Preview: Banshee Legend MK 1
Banshee Legend MK 1
Banshee Bikes have been working on a downhill race bike for some time now and have set up a program to help create a great downhill bike with feedback from ~50 people ranging from engineers to riders alike. It is essentially an engineering project that they’ve opened up to help bring racers and the public (when ready) a bike that meets / exceeds their expectations and earn its place amongst the greatest downhill frames available. Read more inside.
(click to enlarge)
UPDATE: We have finished the project page on the Legend so be sure to check it out for complete details!
The Legend MK 1 is the brainchild of 25 yr old Keith MacLagan Scott Msc Eng. He designed the Legend as part of his Masters in Mechanical Engineering. He incorporated key features he wanted in the design of a great downhill bike such as geometry, kinematics, low stand over, lightweight, low center of gravity, and many more aspects while designing the Legend MK 1. You can see one of his presentations that he created from 2006 HERE (PDF).
The Legend MK 1 is made at Pacific Cycles from Banshee’s engineered designs in Taiwan (not to be confused with Pacific Cycle who make GT Bicycles). The Pacific Cycles sticker on seatstays represent that it is an engineering project and the guys at Banshee wear it on their sleeves like a badge of honor as Pacific Cycles makes a good product.
(click to enlarge)
He went through many iterations with the Legend during his study to develop what he felt was the best wheelpath, leverage ratio, chain strech, and much more. The final exam so to speak was the actual production of the bike you see here. With the help of test riders they plan on refining it where necessary in hopes of bringing out a bike that is, as the name eludes, a legendary bike.
(click to enlarge)
The Banshee Legend features a lot of technology that we won’t go in to too much as this is merely a preview of things to come. As we saddle up and get more time on the Legend we will provide Banshee (and you the reader) more information about our thoughts on the Legend MK 1. The Banshee Blog already has a plethora of information readily available discussing almost every aspect of the bike to date, should you be looking for more information in the short term.
(click to enlarge)
Keith has outlined some other key design issues below:
- Adjustable travel between 7″ and 8.5″ with self adjusting geometry
- An initially rearward axle path for small square edge bump sensitivity
- Initial chain strech of which the rate diminishes as the suspension compresses deeper into its travel, to improve pedaling efficiency, while limiting pedal kickback
- A progressive to linear leverage ratio which will results in a highly efficient pedaling platform
- Active suspension under braking
- Ultra low center of gravity and BB height
- Lateral stiffness to ensure that the power from the pedals goes straight to the back wheel rather than frame flex soaking it up
- Cold form extrusion link and shock actuator
- Bushings instead of bearings that are also easily serviceable and regreaseable
Regarding finalized geometry, Banshee is taking feedback from their riders as well as the 50 test riders’ input to help ensue they have the best geometry they can get based on that data set as well as using them to help refine the frame in every other area. The current geometry can be seen here but the numbers aren’t final by any means.
Frame Details
The current version of the Legend features two different travel settings (8.5″ lower hole, 7″ upper hole).
(click to enlarge)
The Legend MK 1 frame utilizes a 9.5″ x 3″ shock.
(click to enlarge)
The Legend MK 1 uses a triple butted hydroformed tubeset
(click to enlarge)
The Legend MK 1 features integrated tube gussets, internally ribbed chainstays, and internally ribbed seatstays.
(click to enlarge)
The Legend MK 1 frame uses an 83mm bottom bracket shell paired to a Maxle equipped 150mm rear end.
(click to enlarge)
The Legend MK 1 features a 1.5″ head tube and utilizes a 30.9mm seat post.
(click to enlarge)
The Legend MK 1 utilizes a short link4-bar (virtual pivot system) that allowed Keith to tweak the leverage ratio, chain pull, wheelpath, and much more to his specifications.
(click to enlarge)
Curious to see the how the suspension moves and the general wheelpath? Click the picture below to see the Legend in Bikechecker.
Weights:
| Manufacturer | Model | Year | Real(g) | Pic. |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Banshee | Prototype Legend MK1 Large Frame Only |
2009
|
4013 |
 |
| Banshee | Legend MK1 Shock Bolts |
2009
|
41 |
|
| SRAM | 12×150mm Maxle |
2009
|
112 |
|
| Banshee | Legend MK1 Seat Collar |
2009
|
30 |
|
| Cane Creek | Double Barrel 9.5 x 3″ Damper |
2009
|
486 |
|
| Cane Creek | Shock Hardware |
2009
|
6 |
|
| Nuke Proof | 350lb Ti Spring |
2009
|
325 |
|
| . |
Got any questions? Fire them off to info @ bansheebikes.com and check out their blog for even more information under the Legend tag.
UPDATE: We have finished the project page on the Legend so be sure to check it out for complete details!
The Aussies have had a good bit of time on their legends so far, check out Ben Nylen’s video below.
Ben Nylen. from kane chenoweth on Vimeo.
[Banshee Legend MK 1 Gallery] [Banshee Bikes Website]
Facebook
Newsletter
RSS Feeds
Twitter
As one of the lucky 50, I can tell you this bike is phenomenal to ride. But what’s amazing to me is the performance of what is basically the first prototype bike. Designed virtually, beautifully crafted from the start, and does exactly what was intended. With only a few tweaks to the mass production bike, they will have something competitive with the V10s, M6s, and other World Cup bikes without having spent 10 years refining designs. Amazing. The boys at Banshee and Pacific Cycles really know what their doing. Awesome bike guys!
hahaha! did they just copy and paste the frame on the wheelpath?hahaha! because to me the wheel path is the same as a single pivot. So i think although it will not be exactly be the same as the single pivot it will still have the ugly traits of a single pivot!
Are you serious Bill? If so, wow.
Bill, don’t forget to click on the picture to see the animation. What kind of path were you expecting? A zig-zag path? Don’t forget to think of where the rear wheel travels relative to the BB, lower pivot link, etc.
As for your “ugly traits of a single pivot”–your over-generalization doesn’t help your argument.
Looking at the MK 1, I can’t help but think of the new dw-linked DHR–except with the shock lay out being flipped upside down (location of the link connecting the shock to the rear triangle).
Ok J, get that beast built already will ya
JK, it is wonderful to see the documentation of each little detail along the way and I know the many people who do not get to fondle or see the Legend in person very much appreciate it. Great Job!!
As another of the 50 riders I will wholeheartedly agree with Aaron’s comments above. I have not had as much time on mine as the Aussies but I have been flogging it pretty well the past couple of weeks. Something I noticed right away was the incredibly low COG. This thing is REALLY easy to toss about underneath you! There are many more things I could comment on but I will leave that to the forums.
Lookin forward to seeing your parts spec guys. Great stuff.
ohh and Bill…seriously?
I too am one of the 50 riders.
You have put together some nice clean documentation of the bike.
I am looking forward to seeing the usual pimp Sicklines build.
Best of luck there J. Where’s does your laptop mount though?
Oh just wait, we’ve got some sick stuff on it.
Butch - didn’t we agree that you would run alongside?
Its hard to tell, but are there steel inserts in the front triangle shock mounts?
You can see them in the lower linkage shock mount. Nice feature.
Yeah some sick stuff huh….can’t wait to see what all it is:P
BILL just jealous because he got a silly
bullit-2003
I’m one of the 50, and i broke my tibia and fibula on it. Its incredible, that you dont know you are going too fast…LoL!!
OH….dun try to remove the stainless steel pivot by turning the left-handside. the axle is actually inserted from the left, but keyed to the frame, that it cannot be rotated, i break an 8mm allen trying to turn it. later, keith told me should remove the RHS cap, then pops it out with a hammer…XD
tailwind - yep there is a steel insert in the front triangle shock mount.
Ernst - yep i used a punch(wood/nail tool) and a hammer to pop the pivot out. How long are you out with breaking your tibia and fibula?? Ouch.
The link to his presentation doesn’t work.
Hello,
Nice frame with good finished.
It seems a Demo 8 with VPP.
Total weight 5.013 gr . With Ti spring is a normal weight.
With steel spring possible 5213 grs…
Slds.
banj - try again.
XELU - yea I see some similarity as well. The weight is pretty decent (keep in mind its a large, and this is still a prototype).
Expect the weight to drop for production bikes by around 300g…ish
Link works for me now. Thanks.
haha, I’m a bit embarassed by that poster and the early design, oh well that was a few years ago now, and I did throw that poster together in less than an hour using powerpoint. haha super pro!
AROUND 4-5 MONTHS I HOPE..
ITS SEEMS GOING GOOD…
ALTHOUGH ALIGNMENT IS NOT PERFECT…
THE BONES ARE MATCHING NOW
THANKS CHINESE MEDECINE..:)
I CAN WALK ON ONE WALKING STICK…!!
I lend my friend to test this frame Now
you can tell that it comes from the same factory that pumps out the canfield frames
Yes, we use the same factory, but I have personally designed this bike and the Canfield brothers design their bikes. Similarities pretty much end at the fact they are manufactured at the same factory.
Sick frame! Nice built.
offtopic: does anybody have the weight of the nuke proof titanium spring for vivid in 350, 400, 450 or 500lbs on scale?
The weights of the nuke proof ti springs for the vivid should be quite close to the one we have as well (for a 350lb spring at least which is 325g).
I’ll see if I can ask one of the guys at Nuke Proof if they have a “real” weight for a vivid spring for ya.
This looks like it’ll be a nice ride but it certainly doesnt look like anything original enough to really have been a master’s thesis. It basically looks like a Demo 8 got it on with a new Turner DHR…
In fact, now that I looked at his presentation… the axle path almost exactly mirrors the Demo 9, it just moves rearward and extra 10 or 12mm.
Thnx sicklines.
Its that I heard its way heavier (3*400-> 444g) than the regular titanium spring for DHX for example. :S
got an email back, a 350lb vivid is 370g
Bill , the axle path might not be much different than what a bullit has, but the linkage dramatically changes how braking forces, bumps and chain tension affect the rear subframe. The torsion on the subframe now acts on links, and not on a simple bar attached to a pivot. It’s all about the angle and length of those links.
Talked to one of the importers today, and he told me that its a slite possibillity that the Legend frames will be porsponed a little bit due to one of the banshee guys beeing hospitalized. I hope its nothing serious or that im wrong. Not because im waiting for a frame (cuz i am) but its allways sad to see people that does great work being ill, or worse. Or any one being hospitalized at all.